your boot camp<\/a> for almost four years, and because everything that you teach, and correct me if I’m wrong, but everything you teach, it is about growth. It’s about expansion, not necessarily accumulation, but growth and expansion and freedom really, and creation on purpose, right?<\/span><\/p>\nDenise Duffield-Thomas:<\/strong> Yeah. <\/span><\/p>\nJenev Caddell:<\/strong> And again, you’ve been so transparent in that and I’ve been able to see so many people around me upgrading in big ways and in the community, because it is such a supportive and beautiful space where people share wins and all of the rest. I know an issue that comes up a lot is that many times, like you mentioned in the very beginning, these women entrepreneurs start doing incredible work in their businesses and some chose to bring their partners on board, which is kind of what you’ve done. I wanted to ask you a little bit about what that’s been like. If you have any advice for people who are in that position, because it is a tricky one, right, I’m sure.<\/span><\/p>\nDenise Duffield-Thomas:<\/strong> Yeah it is. It’s really awesome and it’s really hard sometimes too. For us, when we first got together, Mark and I have been together since 2003, we spoke about one day we’re gonna be millionaires and we’re gonna have this freedom based life. We literally spoke about that from day one of our relationship. Yes, which was great, and so I was always working towards, even though from the outside it probably looked like I was like dabbling, but I was trying to find my thing for a long time. I was trying different blogs and I’d go to courses and conferences because that was always my dream. <\/span><\/p>\n Then Mark went into corporate space and he just climbed ladder after ladder, and I didn’t feel like he was coming on our journey with me for a long time. I remember he used to get really stressed about his job too. He’d grind his teeth at night and we had X amount of holiday days a year that he could take. He was working in the sporting industry and he was working for two different … He was working for football and soccer. They have different seasons, so he’d have one season and then the next season would start. We could never go on holidays. I was actually starting become more abundant in my business, so I wanted to go places and I wanted to do things.<\/span><\/p>\n We had a couple of retreats in Bali that I was running, and he came along. My mom came to one of them and then he came to the other one. This big crisis at work happened while we were in Bali. We were in this beautiful place and he’s like on his phone, on his computer. He had to look after Willow while I was at this retreat, and he said he had to be on a conference call, and Willow ripped her nappy of and did a poo on the floor, while he was on this conference call, which all moms have had to deal with, by the way, all moms know that. <\/span><\/p>\n He was just like, ugh, I have to do this, and I’m going, you really don’t. You really could leave now. We had to leave Bali. I had finished the retreat and we had to leave that night because he had to be at work the next morning. We got in at 6:30, he had to be at work at 9:00. I just went, this is not working for me anymore. This is not working for me anymore. He was incredibly reluctant to leave his job. I want people to hear this too. This wasn’t when I was already making a million dollars in my business. <\/span><\/p>\n When we started this dream together, he said, “As soon as you earn six figures, I’m outta my job.”.<\/span><\/p>\nJenev Caddell:<\/strong> Six figures, wow.<\/span><\/p>\nDenise Duffield-Thomas:<\/strong> Yeah, and that hit and he goes, “As soon as you earn 300,000 I’m out of my job.” “As soon as you earn 500,000, I’m out of my job.”, and the hurdles kept on going and going. It was because, honestly, he was really scared to give up his identity as a man. When we finally had words about it, where I’m like, “Dude, I think I might leave you if you don’t leave your job, and I’m not saying that lightly, and I’m not saying that to be a bitch, but this is not what I signed up for. I signed up for a co creation of freedom as a family, and this ain’t it. You’ve given me all these hurdles, I’ve overcome them all. We could have afforded it years ago, what’s going on.” He said, “What will I tell people that I do?” \u00a0That was it. That is what he was really worried about, and he still is a little bit worried about that sometimes. <\/span><\/p>\n He’s like, “Oh, I really wanna do my own stuff too, because then I wouldn’t tell people I’m just working for your business.”, I’m like, “Well, it’s a family business.”. I say that to be like it’s not about the money most of the time. A friend of mine, she doesn’t have an aspiration to have a massive big business, but she’s just convinced her hubby to go part-time at his job, because they have a nice life. They’ve got a small mortgage, and I think that’s the key as well. Of creating this lifestyle where it’s like you have smaller expenses so you don’t have to have a million dollars before your spouse can quit. <\/span><\/p>\n For us, it’s been wonderful and really challenging. Even when it’s challenging moments, I think, I so prefer him here, than at a job and gnashing his teeth and grinding his teeth at night. We have that freedom, but of course it has its own challenges as well. Just to let people know, if that’s your goal, you have to be the keeper of that flame. I was really pissed off that he wasn’t doing more to make that a reality for our family, and then I realized, nope, this is my job. I have to be the one to keep the vision for our family to do this, and I kind of have to be the one to nudge him along, because it will never happen otherwise. <\/span><\/p>\n That’s what it was with my friend. It was just never gonna happen. She had to nudge him, nudge him, nudge him. Okay, put in for part-time at work, come on. That’s our job, because we’re good at it and we make shit happen. <\/span><\/p>\nJenev Caddell:<\/strong> Yeah, and well you’re just basically showing up and speaking your truth and saying heres where I’m at, this is what I signed up for, and sharing that. I think in relationships, we all challenge each other to step up in some ways. Do you know what I mean, which is what I imagine, and I’m maybe assuming, but I imagine he’s happy that he’s happy that he left?<\/span><\/p>\nDenise Duffield-Thomas:<\/strong> I think so. Sometimes I think it would be easier for him where he’s respected as the boss, whereas in our relationship, I am the boss in lots of ways. I know he loves … Like yesterday, it was his day with the kids. He took them to the beach. They had a picnic. It was a weekday and there’s no one at the beach, and I know that, that is worth it, but that doesn’t require you to have a multi million dollar business to do that. <\/span><\/p>\n For a lot of people, it’s way cheaper than that, but you have to paint the picture. I’ve been painting that picture for years about how that could be, and trying to understand that he doesn’t have to support system that I’ve had for years, where I see it’s possible. I have daily conversations with women about what we’re doing. They don’t have that, so we’re trying to get them to get up to speed with it, but they don’t have the support, and it’s scary. You and I both know that, when you start your business, where you start something new, it’s terrifying, but women are really good at creating the networks. We’re like, go girlfriend, you can do it, look I’ve done it, you can do it too. They don’t have that, so we have to be mindful of that too. <\/span><\/p>\nJenev Caddell:<\/strong> That’s part, I think too, of the paradigm shift as well, right, that we were talking about before, is having that community, having that collective, having that, you know I mean, just being surrounded in your community with people with have that network. It’s just so key and we’re wired for it. Men are too, we are all wired for it as humans, but you’re right, they don’t have it in that same way. <\/span><\/p>\nDenise Duffield-Thomas:<\/strong> You’ll laugh about this because you’re in the boot camp, but I said to him, something like, why won’t you leave, I was like ahhh, and then it was like 11:00 at night, we’re in bed in the dark and he starts saying I’m scared about this and I’m scared about that, and I was like, for God’s sake, just do some EFT (Emotional Freedom Technique)<\/em> on it. He was like what, because I talk about it all day long with thousands of women. I’m just like, tap and forgive. He’s like, ugh, I’m not sure about how to do tapping. I’m like, how can you not know to do tapping. I talk about this 24\/7, and I was like, oh, but I don’t share all that stuff with him. <\/span><\/p>\n I’m just expecting him to absorb that, so that’s important too, but this paradigm shift that is happening, I do see some men are not being supportive of it. It’s heartbreaking. We’ve seen this in our group where people say like, oh, my husband’s sabotaging me, and it’s tough because not every marriage can survive the growth. Some can, some can’t, but that doesn’t mean you hold yourself small because of it. <\/span><\/p>\nJenev Caddell:<\/strong> Absolutely. I agree with you 100%. I wanted to ask you a question that you mentioned, and I know that we should wrap up pretty soon, but – <\/span><\/p>\nDenise Duffield-Thomas:<\/strong> No, we’re good.<\/span><\/p>\nJenev Caddell:<\/strong> Okay, good. I wanted to ask, you mentioned something on your livestream about how it was a bit of a challenge for you to step into your zone of genius and to get that support yourself in a bigger way. Can you talk about that a little bit, about what you mean, do you know what I’m talking, do you remember saying this?<\/span><\/p>\nDenise Duffield-Thomas:<\/strong> Yeah, well I suck at delegating. I’m better now, but I even when I was in corporate, I always sought out roles where I was the lone wolf. Who could just do my own projects and not have to deal with people. This whole concept even of being allowed to do the things that you want to do, or that you enjoy, and not have to do the other things, is alien to most women because we’re used to doing all the things for everyone, whether we like them or not. <\/span><\/p>\n The Big Leap<\/a><\/em><\/strong>, by Gay Hendricks, he talks about things that you suck at, things that you’re okay at, things that you’re excellent about, but things that you’re genius with. There’s a real fine line between the excellence and the genius. I think the last couple of years, I’ve just become better at going, what do I like doing, what am I really, really good at, what can I let go, and allowing other people to step into those spaces instead of me. You know what, they usually do them so much better than I do, and they do them without being triggered by stuff or they do it without procrastinating. They’re like, oh I’ll just send that email no big deal, whereas I’ll be like, oh, am I worthy of being interviewed by that person, I don’t know. <\/span><\/p>\n I say now in my business, I’m like this is the only thing that I can’t outsource. If you turn out for this interview and I’ve got like a Denise puppet, it ain’t gonna work. I try to say to my team, you guys have to do everything else, because this is the thing that I can do. I can show up and help people, but I shouldn’t be doing anything else. Yeah, and it’s really hard. I’m not saying it’s easy. It’s really freaking hard because it brings up your own stuff about being a diva or people think you don’t work hoard or that you’re not worthy of your abundance or being a bitch or all these other things. <\/span><\/p>\n When Mark came into my business and he started taking over a lot of operations, I didn’t want to tell anyone, which is so weird, because so many people in our community want to work with their husbands or want to retire their husbands. I was like holding it back because I thought, oh my God, people are just gonna think I’m the biggest, laziest, freaking diva ever. Not only do I have help at home, but I don’t have to do everything in my business anymore. Oh, my God, I’m really not worthy of abundance. That was only this year that I didn’t want to tell people, you know, because it’s the same old money block for me. You have to work really hard to make money. <\/span><\/p>\nJenev Caddell:<\/strong> Well it’s like the interior designer who doesn’t charge, it’s just an extension of that for all of us with the worth and with the, things can be easy sometimes. <\/span><\/p>\nDenise Duffield-Thomas:<\/strong> They can, and we will resist the crap out of it. The reason why I share that though is because the money mindset work is ongoing. Honestly it’s usually the same block that stops you from making your first hundred dollars. Same that stops you from making your first 1,000, 10,000, 100,000, a million. It’s the same stuff but it will come up in slightly different ways, which is why you need to be constantly in this conversation and communities where you can explore that and realize it’s usually the same stuff. The numbers are different, you might have a couple extra zeros in it, but the feeling feels the same to you, and that’s why women hit a plateau, get through it, but hit another one. <\/span><\/p>\n It’s not just like you the money work once, and then it’s plain sailing to billions. It’s constant, and sometimes you become, you’re in maintenance mode, and that’s cool too. It takes a lot of money mindset work at the start to uncover all that crap, and then you can cruise through it in maintenance mode, but then as soon as you wanna go, maybe a bigger goal, or a different aspect, like retiring your husband, it’s gonna bring it up again. It doesn’t mean you have to start from zero though, which is good because you’ve got a foundation. It just means you have to go through the same lessons, but at least you can build on it. <\/span><\/p>\nJenev Caddell:<\/strong> I just appreciate, again, so much about open and transparent you are with just your own process with all that, because it’s stuff people don’t really talk about.<\/span><\/p>\nDenise Duffield-Thomas:<\/strong> Yeah, but that’s a great tip for everyone listening. In your own business, it’s just so easy to tell the truth, and you don’t have to be anything, you don’t have to pretend to be anything. I like telling the truth because then I think nobody can accuse me of anything because I’ve just told them it anyway. They’d be like you are so, I’m like yeah, I know I just told you that. I know I’m not good at that, I told you. Tell the truth. It’s so much easier. <\/span><\/p>\nJenev Caddell:<\/strong> So good, and let go too of some things that, I mean I think that is … You at this level in your business, are still coming up against that, is just so much for the rest of us. Do you know what I mean, it’s really, it’s stuff that we have to, it’s an ongoing process. It’s an ongoing thing. The work doesn’t stop. <\/span><\/p>\nDenise Duffield-Thomas:<\/strong> No, it doesn’t, and I know that sometimes feels sucky to hear, because you’re thinking but I’m working so hard now, and it’s like what scares you today won’t scare you tomorrow. There’s always new things to be scared about in business, and that’s the bad news, but it’s like you’re gonna evolve and you just only have to look at the next step. A lot of women start to pre worry about like how am I gonna pay this massive tax bill when I have a million dollar business. It’s like, honey, get your first client. See if you like it. Just worry about what’s in front of you right now. <\/span><\/p>\n I do it myself, I used to think, what if Oprah wants me to be, like to run a show on her network and I hate getting up at 3:00 in the morning and TV shows want you to do makeup at 3:00. I like to start psych myself out and it’s like, Oh my God, just do the next thing that’s in front of you. Don’t pre worry about things that will never happen or is so far ahead of you. You’ll be a different person. You can handle things. You can handle that.<\/span><\/p>\nJenev Caddell:<\/strong> We don’t have the resources now, that we will at that point, right?<\/span><\/p>\nDenise Duffield-Thomas:<\/strong> Oh, exactly. The internal resources, the practice around boundaries, around saying no, that you’ll have. Just focus on the next little thing. The next conversation. The next client. The next tax bracket. Just do it incrementally, because when you actually do that incrementally, things paradoxically move quick because you’re not psyching yourself out. If you think it has to be quick, I see then people stagnate for years.<\/span><\/p>\nJenev Caddell:<\/strong> Yes, oh that’s interesting. That’s so interesting to hear that. Well I know Denise has an incredible webinar, an incredible training I wanna share since we’re talking about upgrading and we’re talking about all of that. You guys can check it out at mybestrelationship.com\/upgrade, and Denise’s boot camp is coming out soon, again, which is just, I will talk more about that as well, but Denise, if you have any, well you have so much wisdom that you shared today, and I just love talking with you. It’s such an opportunity for me to learn from you, but is any parting wisdom that you wanna share around, I don’t know, just kinda back where we started in terms of these sort of shaky, murky kind of rough times, this rough patch that I think historically we’re in that’s like, we’re gonna look back on this and be like, whoa. Anything you wanna share, advice, tips?<\/span><\/p>\nDenise Duffield-Thomas:<\/strong> Yes, so money is neutral. Money can be a tool for good, but it requires good people to use money for good. When you look around at women in your community, and your business friends, we’re the ones that need to step up and have a little bit of money and use money for good. You’ve kind of gotta see it as not a moral imperative, that sounds really like, but it kind of is.<\/span><\/p>\nJenev Caddell:<\/strong> It’s a responsibility.<\/span><\/p>\nDenise Duffield-Thomas:<\/strong> It is. We can’t complain about how the world is at the moment because it’s been created by rich men in lots of ways and they’ve done a great job in some ways, and a shitty job in some ways. They’re not gonna change the way they are. It’s time for us to link hands, raise up and fill in some of those gaps that are missing. Use the infrastructure that they’ve created for us and use that to shape the world in a way that is gonna benefit so many more people on the planet. It’s our time. It’s not their time anymore, but it’s our time to rise up and meet them there too. So, why not, it’s now. It’s happening right now. We can’t wait anymore. It’s happening right now. <\/span><\/p>\nJenev Caddell:<\/strong> It really is, and I just wanna thank you for really being a pioneer and really making it, you know when you mentioned that about just doing this in a bigger way on your livestream, I was like, oh my gosh, thank God, she’s [inaudible 00:30:36] do you know what I mean, and you know I just, because we do need community to do this. None of us can do this ourselves and we can go so much further collectively. I just appreciate you so much for bringing this conversation to the table and for all the work that you do and for your incredible boot camp. Helping all of us deal with our own inner stuff and the outer stuff, just everything to really shift our own lives around businesses, but also our own communities and the world. <\/span><\/p>\nDenise Duffield-Thomas:<\/strong> Yes, the world needs us. It’s an exciting time, so encourage your girlfriends as well, because everyone’s feeling a bit scared, a bit vulnerable. That’s how we can do it, just by encouraging each other and not playing into the scarcity stuff and not bitching about other women. Keeping things positive and encouraging because I see people sometimes get bitchy about stuff in the industry and it’s like, there’s bigger problems. Let’s focus on what’s really important. Let’s encourage each other. <\/span><\/p>\nJenev Caddell:<\/strong> Amen. Denise, this is awesome, as always, thank you so, so much.<\/span><\/p>\nDenise Duffield-Thomas:<\/strong> Thanks for having me again. I’ll talk to you in another two years or earlier than that?<\/span><\/p>\nJenev Caddell:<\/strong> Sooner than that, okay?<\/span><\/p>\nDenise Duffield-Thomas:<\/strong> Okay, cool. Thanks everybody.<\/span><\/p>\nJenev Caddell:<\/strong> Thank you. Thanks everybody. Take care, bye.<\/span><\/p>\n***<\/p>\n
Join Denise’s FREE Money Mindset workshop HERE<\/a><\/strong> to discover\u00a0The 3 Mistakes That Keep Women Entrepreneurs Broke and Exhausted – And How You Can Eliminate Them.<\/p>\nGet Denise’s FREE training on upgrading your business HERE.<\/a><\/strong><\/p>\nJoin Denise’s Money Bootcamp HERE<\/strong><\/a> and drop me a note via my contact form to claim your free 12-month membership in My Best Relationship Society.<\/em><\/p>\n